Youtube Interviews
In this episode of Roadmap to Heaven, host Adam Wright invites special guest Father Jeffery Kirby to discuss the significance of the 12 Days of Christmas song.
Father Kirby starts by delving into the origins of the popular song “The 12 Days of Christmas.” He explains that the song originated from the influence of Western culture on the Christian faith. Each part of the song references an aspect of the Christian tradition, such as the two commandments, the three gifts of faith, hope, and love, and the four gospel books.
The discussion highlights the symbolic meaning behind each gift mentioned in the song. For example, the first gift, the Turtle Dove, represents Jesus Christ. The 11 pipers piping symbolize the faithful apostles celebrating the resurrection of Jesus. The 12th part of the song refers to the 12 points of the Apostles’ Creed, directing the singer back to the teachings of the faith.
Father Kirby proposes the idea of bringing elements of faith back into our celebrations, especially during the 12-day Christmas season. He suggests using traditional songs like the 12 Days of Christmas to remind Christians of the true meaning of Christmas and to teach and memorize elements of the faith. He believes that popular culture can be used as a tool for evangelization and emphasizes the difference between secular Christmas celebrations and the Christian Christmas celebrated by believers.
Overall, this episode of Roadmap to Heaven provides information on the significance of the 12 Days of Christmas song and encourages listeners to embrace the fullness of the Christmas season, beyond just a single day, in a way that deepens their faith.
Adam Wright:
There is a countdown going on right now in our Catholic faith. And if you have been paying attention here on Roadmap to Heaven, you know precisely what I’m talking about. It’s not the 12 days of Christmas. It’s the O Antiphons as we are in the midst of this Christmas Novena. Singing, “Oh come, oh come, Emmanuel.” But where do the 12 days of Christmas come from? Is that something just made up by those that are singing songs about reindeer and snowmen and other jolly things? Well, no. This is actually another tradition of our faith, and it’s what comes next, the 12 days of Christmas following these O Antiphons. Here to talk about this with us, we’re happy to welcome back, Father Jeffrey Kirby, pastor of our Lady of Grace down in South Carolina. Father, it’s good to have you with us today.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Thank you, Adam. Good to be on the show.
Adam Wright:
So tell us about these 12 days, because I know so many of us have thought, at one point or another in life, that the 12 days are the countdown, and my true love’s going to just give me better and better gifts as we get closer to Christmas.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. So the 12 days of Christmas, it actually is the 12 days of the Christmas season. So oftentimes, the church, we can forget that just as advent is a season, and ordinary time is a season. Christmas is a season. So there’s a season of Christmas, and the 12 days mark that season. So from Christmas day (December 25th) until the feast of the Epiphany (traditionally celebrated on January 6th). So you have these 12 days. And so this popular song was written in order to recount the 12 days of Christmas. Now that might shock some initial listeners today because they’re like, “Wait a minute. The culture came up with this? The popular culture?” Yes. There was actually a time in which western culture actually followed the church’s liturgical year. So you wouldn’t have Christmas decorations until later in advent. And then, of course, the Christmas season would be fully celebrated and this popular song is a way of recounting, reminding, celebrating the 12 days of Christmas.
Adam Wright:
I’m laughing right now because I think of all of the secular music outlets that stop playing Christmas music at midnight on the 26th. And yet here we have the culture at one point in time being a Christian culture giving us these 12 days. Now, again, this is one of those things that we think, alright. Well, a partridge in a pear tree, 2 turtle doves, 3 French hens, 4 calling birds, 5 golden rings. All of these things. That’s that’s where I stop. You know, I can get to 5 golden rings. Somewhere around there, there’s geese a laying, and swans a swimming, and ladies dancing, and pipers piping, and all of that. And 12 lords a leaping. I know that one. These are not empty symbols. Like, what did they give each other when they wrote this song? Well, they must have given each other 5 golden rings every year for Christmas. I don’t know. Father, can you tell us a little bit about what we’re singing in these verses?
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yeah. So, very beautifully, this popular song, and again, I just want to stress this is a popular song that came from the culture. So if we imagine that we have Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer, and Frosty the Snowman, these type of songs today, there was a time, again, which western culture influenced part of the Christian faith. These are the type of songs, the 12 days of Christmas, that’s what we would have been singing. So can we just go to some of the aspects of the song? So first, that very first one, the Turtle Dove, that’s actually the Lord Jesus. So the first and preeminent gift, the infinitely superior gift to all other all others is that first gift. Right? So and that references, of course, Jesus Christ. So we talk about that first gift. And then if we go from there, every other part of the song references some part of our tradition. So for example, the first day is the Lord Jesus. The second day are the 2 testaments. So the Old Testament, the New Testament. Then we have the 3 gifts of faith, hope, and love. Those are the theological virtues that we receive at baptism. Then we talk about the fourth gifts. Well, those are the 4 gospel books. Then it goes on and on and on. So every part of the song references an aspect of the catechism, a part of our tradition. And of course, the ones I really love is towards the end, the 11 pipers piping. That references the 11 faithful apostles who are dancing and playing and singing and rejoicing in the resurrection of Jesus Christ and all that God has done among us. Right? And then the twelfth, that references the 12 points of the Apostles’ Creed. So it ends by directing the one who’s singing back to the Apostles’ Creed, back to the teachings of the faith. These are the type of songs we used to sing, Adam.
Adam Wright:
Okay. I think I’m going to have to get my song sheet out here, Father, and be ready to go in the 12 days of Christmas. And it’s one of those things that when you think about it, it makes sense. Like, wait. Hold on. 4 calling birds, well, what do calling birds do? They sing. They proclaim their song. What do the evangelists do? Well, they proclaim the word of God. They proclaim the gospel. So now, okay, this does start to make perfect sense here. And again, last time we spoke, we were talking about the Jesse Tree and how we could use the Jesse Tree as a tool to teach our children about the lineage of our Lord. Again, here’s another beautiful thing we can use to teach our children about aspects of the faith by every day, maybe we sing another verse and we talk with the children about, “Okay, kids. Today, we’re talking about 4 calling birds. Let’s talk about the 4 evangelists.”
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. Amen. Exactly, and this is where we can see where popular, good popular culture can actually be a help to us. So we know we evangelize through culture. And so here we can use these means of culture in the Christian home and with our neighbors, whatever their faith might be, in order to highlight some of the parts of our faith. So the partridge and the pear tree. I mean, that’s just beautiful. You imagine this pear tree, it’s about life the partridge is there, the partridge is known for its purity and its whiteness, and the singing, and so on. And to talk about who Jesus Christ is, that He has come to us, right? Our beloved, that God the Father has given us this partridge in a pear tree. And then to your point, the 4 gospel books, and the calling birds, and so on, and just use this every day, say, “Okay. What does this one mean? Now we’re on the 4th day of Christmas. Here’s the 4th gift. On the 8th day of Christmas, what is the 8th gift?” and so on. And while it’s being sung, it’s being memorized. And we all know, like, we can try to memorize things until the cows come home. But teach us a song or give us a jingle? It’s an earworm. We can’t get that thing out of our head. You know? So, I think that here we have historic popular culture in the west that can still be very helpful to us.
Adam Wright:
Father, you and I have spoken before about re-Christianizing our celebrations and just bringing back elements of our faith into what we do. Now, I know as we count down the days here in these final days of advent, all of the children in the United States are excited, not just for Christmas Mass, but also for the presents that they will receive. But I also know that culturally, especially for our brothers and sisters over in Europe, and I think in South America, too. Epiphany is really the big celebration, the twelfth night celebration that the Holy day is Christmas, but the party day is Epiphany, and that’s the culmination of these 12 days. As you said earlier, if we start on Christmas day, we’re going to end on the 12th day, January 6th, the Epiphany. And so this could also be an occasion to say, alright. Especially this coming year, 2023, January 6th is a Friday. So that’s not a day for a party, you know, going into the weekend. This could be a really great idea for us.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. Very much so. And I think that these are opportunities, and I think the Christian family, as we try to re-Christianize so many of our Holy days, our sacred seasons. This is one resource that’s given to Christian families because, honestly, I pray a lot for the families under my care, for the Christian family in general, because the odds are against the Christian family. The odds are against Christian culture. And so we have to be even more intentional, more creative. And part of that , as the Lord tells us, the wise steward draws from the old and the new. So we can draw from historic Western culture, for example, songs like The 12 Days of Christmas, and then use that in order to then remind especially young Christians, but the Christian family in general, what the Lord has done, what Christmas is. That Christmas is a season we continue to celebrate. So when children are saying, “Why are the neighbors throwing out their Christmas trees on December 26th? And why have all the Christmas music stopped right after Christmas day, the 25th?” Here, we begin to teach and explain why.
We begin to see very clearly that there are 2 Christmases being celebrated. I call it the secular Christmas. So, they’ve taken our word, they’ve taken our Holy day, and they’ve turned it into something else. The secular Christmas is out there. As we joked before the show, Adam, that started sometime around Halloween. Right? You know? And it abruptly ends at midnight on the 25th. Right? So, the Lord Jesus turns into a pumpkin by secular mentality, it’s midnight, Christmas is over. Okay. Throw it out. It’s done. But we Christians, we have to hold on to our Holy day. We have a different Christmas, and we have to make sure we mark the full Christmas season. I think it’s just beautiful that the church, by having this Christmas season, is teaching us that one single chronological day cannot contain the mystery of God becoming a man. That we have to just celebrate. So you mentioned the church calls us to penance during lent, and advent, and various times of the year. This is one of the times where the church is saying, “Celebrate.” Right? “Rejoice. Enjoy this. Dance. Enjoy.” Right? You know? I think that we have to let ourselves celebrate this.
Adam Wright:
I plan on partying all Christmas season long, and pun intended on this one. I am going to use the grace period of the 12 days of Christmas to not have to rush out and finish all of my Christmas shopping by the 24th. I like to, sprinkle some of those presents in for family and friends and loved ones, especially my Catholic family friends and loved ones, taking advantage of those full 12 days to to spread Christmas cheer. Father, could I ask you one last time before we conclude Advent? We’re still in Advent here, friends, as much as we’ve been talking about Christmas. Could I ask you to help us get ready in these final days with prayer?
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Let us pray. Father, we thank you for the gift of your son. We ask that you keep our hearts focused on Him as we walk amidst our world, as we see secular versions of our Holy days. We ask you to keep our focus on you, that we understand that the one true gift is your son and the opportunity of salvation in Him. We ask you to bless us. We praise you. We adore you. We magnify you. We give you thanks. We do all of this through Christ our Lord, Amen. Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
Adam Wright:
Well, Father Kirby, thank you so much for spending a couple weeks with us this advent to help us get ready for the coming of our Lord. On behalf of all of us here at Covenant Network, we’d like to wish you and your parishioners a very, very merry Christmas and a prosperous joy-filled New Year.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Thank you, Adam. Merry Christmas. God bless you.
Adam Wright:
There is a countdown going on right now in our Catholic faith. And if you have been paying attention here on Roadmap to Heaven, you know precisely what I’m talking about. It’s not the 12 days of Christmas. It’s the O Antiphons as we are in the midst of this Christmas Novena. Singing, “Oh come, oh come, Emmanuel.” But where do the 12 days of Christmas come from? Is that something just made up by those that are singing songs about reindeer and snowmen and other jolly things? Well, no. This is actually another tradition of our faith, and it’s what comes next, the 12 days of Christmas following these O Antiphons. Here to talk about this with us, we’re happy to welcome back, Father Jeffrey Kirby, pastor of our Lady of Grace down in South Carolina. Father, it’s good to have you with us today.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Thank you, Adam. Good to be on the show.
Adam Wright:
So tell us about these 12 days, because I know so many of us have thought, at one point or another in life, that the 12 days are the countdown, and my true love’s going to just give me better and better gifts as we get closer to Christmas.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. So the 12 days of Christmas, it actually is the 12 days of the Christmas season. So oftentimes, the church, we can forget that just as advent is a season, and ordinary time is a season. Christmas is a season. So there’s a season of Christmas, and the 12 days mark that season. So from Christmas day (December 25th) until the feast of the Epiphany (traditionally celebrated on January 6th). So you have these 12 days. And so this popular song was written in order to recount the 12 days of Christmas. Now that might shock some initial listeners today because they’re like, “Wait a minute. The culture came up with this? The popular culture?” Yes. There was actually a time in which western culture actually followed the church’s liturgical year. So you wouldn’t have Christmas decorations until later in advent. And then, of course, the Christmas season would be fully celebrated and this popular song is a way of recounting, reminding, celebrating the 12 days of Christmas.
Adam Wright:
I’m laughing right now because I think of all of the secular music outlets that stop playing Christmas music at midnight on the 26th. And yet here we have the culture at one point in time being a Christian culture giving us these 12 days. Now, again, this is one of those things that we think, alright. Well, a partridge in a pear tree, 2 turtle doves, 3 French hens, 4 calling birds, 5 golden rings. All of these things. That’s that’s where I stop. You know, I can get to 5 golden rings. Somewhere around there, there’s geese a laying, and swans a swimming, and ladies dancing, and pipers piping, and all of that. And 12 lords a leaping. I know that one. These are not empty symbols. Like, what did they give each other when they wrote this song? Well, they must have given each other 5 golden rings every year for Christmas. I don’t know. Father, can you tell us a little bit about what we’re singing in these verses?
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yeah. So, very beautifully, this popular song, and again, I just want to stress this is a popular song that came from the culture. So if we imagine that we have Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer, and Frosty the Snowman, these type of songs today, there was a time, again, which western culture influenced part of the Christian faith. These are the type of songs, the 12 days of Christmas, that’s what we would have been singing. So can we just go to some of the aspects of the song? So first, that very first one, the Turtle Dove, that’s actually the Lord Jesus. So the first and preeminent gift, the infinitely superior gift to all other all others is that first gift. Right? So and that references, of course, Jesus Christ. So we talk about that first gift. And then if we go from there, every other part of the song references some part of our tradition. So for example, the first day is the Lord Jesus. The second day are the 2 testaments. So the Old Testament, the New Testament. Then we have the 3 gifts of faith, hope, and love. Those are the theological virtues that we receive at baptism. Then we talk about the fourth gifts. Well, those are the 4 gospel books. Then it goes on and on and on. So every part of the song references an aspect of the catechism, a part of our tradition. And of course, the ones I really love is towards the end, the 11 pipers piping. That references the 11 faithful apostles who are dancing and playing and singing and rejoicing in the resurrection of Jesus Christ and all that God has done among us. Right? And then the twelfth, that references the 12 points of the Apostles’ Creed. So it ends by directing the one who’s singing back to the Apostles’ Creed, back to the teachings of the faith. These are the type of songs we used to sing, Adam.
Adam Wright:
Okay. I think I’m going to have to get my song sheet out here, Father, and be ready to go in the 12 days of Christmas. And it’s one of those things that when you think about it, it makes sense. Like, wait. Hold on. 4 calling birds, well, what do calling birds do? They sing. They proclaim their song. What do the evangelists do? Well, they proclaim the word of God. They proclaim the gospel. So now, okay, this does start to make perfect sense here. And again, last time we spoke, we were talking about the Jesse Tree and how we could use the Jesse Tree as a tool to teach our children about the lineage of our Lord. Again, here’s another beautiful thing we can use to teach our children about aspects of the faith by every day, maybe we sing another verse and we talk with the children about, “Okay, kids. Today, we’re talking about 4 calling birds. Let’s talk about the 4 evangelists.”
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. Amen. Exactly, and this is where we can see where popular, good popular culture can actually be a help to us. So we know we evangelize through culture. And so here we can use these means of culture in the Christian home and with our neighbors, whatever their faith might be, in order to highlight some of the parts of our faith. So the partridge and the pear tree. I mean, that’s just beautiful. You imagine this pear tree, it’s about life the partridge is there, the partridge is known for its purity and its whiteness, and the singing, and so on. And to talk about who Jesus Christ is, that He has come to us, right? Our beloved, that God the Father has given us this partridge in a pear tree. And then to your point, the 4 gospel books, and the calling birds, and so on, and just use this every day, say, “Okay. What does this one mean? Now we’re on the 4th day of Christmas. Here’s the 4th gift. On the 8th day of Christmas, what is the 8th gift?” and so on. And while it’s being sung, it’s being memorized. And we all know, like, we can try to memorize things until the cows come home. But teach us a song or give us a jingle? It’s an earworm. We can’t get that thing out of our head. You know? So, I think that here we have historic popular culture in the west that can still be very helpful to us.
Adam Wright:
Father, you and I have spoken before about re-Christianizing our celebrations and just bringing back elements of our faith into what we do. Now, I know as we count down the days here in these final days of advent, all of the children in the United States are excited, not just for Christmas Mass, but also for the presents that they will receive. But I also know that culturally, especially for our brothers and sisters over in Europe, and I think in South America, too. Epiphany is really the big celebration, the twelfth night celebration that the Holy day is Christmas, but the party day is Epiphany, and that’s the culmination of these 12 days. As you said earlier, if we start on Christmas day, we’re going to end on the 12th day, January 6th, the Epiphany. And so this could also be an occasion to say, alright. Especially this coming year, 2023, January 6th is a Friday. So that’s not a day for a party, you know, going into the weekend. This could be a really great idea for us.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Yes. Very much so. And I think that these are opportunities, and I think the Christian family, as we try to re-Christianize so many of our Holy days, our sacred seasons. This is one resource that’s given to Christian families because, honestly, I pray a lot for the families under my care, for the Christian family in general, because the odds are against the Christian family. The odds are against Christian culture. And so we have to be even more intentional, more creative. And part of that , as the Lord tells us, the wise steward draws from the old and the new. So we can draw from historic Western culture, for example, songs like The 12 Days of Christmas, and then use that in order to then remind especially young Christians, but the Christian family in general, what the Lord has done, what Christmas is. That Christmas is a season we continue to celebrate. So when children are saying, “Why are the neighbors throwing out their Christmas trees on December 26th? And why have all the Christmas music stopped right after Christmas day, the 25th?” Here, we begin to teach and explain why.
We begin to see very clearly that there are 2 Christmases being celebrated. I call it the secular Christmas. So, they’ve taken our word, they’ve taken our Holy day, and they’ve turned it into something else. The secular Christmas is out there. As we joked before the show, Adam, that started sometime around Halloween. Right? You know? And it abruptly ends at midnight on the 25th. Right? So, the Lord Jesus turns into a pumpkin by secular mentality, it’s midnight, Christmas is over. Okay. Throw it out. It’s done. But we Christians, we have to hold on to our Holy day. We have a different Christmas, and we have to make sure we mark the full Christmas season. I think it’s just beautiful that the church, by having this Christmas season, is teaching us that one single chronological day cannot contain the mystery of God becoming a man. That we have to just celebrate. So you mentioned the church calls us to penance during lent, and advent, and various times of the year. This is one of the times where the church is saying, “Celebrate.” Right? “Rejoice. Enjoy this. Dance. Enjoy.” Right? You know? I think that we have to let ourselves celebrate this.
Adam Wright:
I plan on partying all Christmas season long, and pun intended on this one. I am going to use the grace period of the 12 days of Christmas to not have to rush out and finish all of my Christmas shopping by the 24th. I like to, sprinkle some of those presents in for family and friends and loved ones, especially my Catholic family friends and loved ones, taking advantage of those full 12 days to to spread Christmas cheer. Father, could I ask you one last time before we conclude Advent? We’re still in Advent here, friends, as much as we’ve been talking about Christmas. Could I ask you to help us get ready in these final days with prayer?
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Let us pray. Father, we thank you for the gift of your son. We ask that you keep our hearts focused on Him as we walk amidst our world, as we see secular versions of our Holy days. We ask you to keep our focus on you, that we understand that the one true gift is your son and the opportunity of salvation in Him. We ask you to bless us. We praise you. We adore you. We magnify you. We give you thanks. We do all of this through Christ our Lord, Amen. Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
Adam Wright:
Well, Father Kirby, thank you so much for spending a couple weeks with us this advent to help us get ready for the coming of our Lord. On behalf of all of us here at Covenant Network, we’d like to wish you and your parishioners a very, very merry Christmas and a prosperous joy-filled New Year.
Fr. Jeffrey Kirby:
Thank you, Adam. Merry Christmas. God bless you.
In this episode of Roadmap to Heaven, host Adam Wright invites special guest Father Jeffery Kirby to discuss the significance of the 12 Days of Christmas song.
Father Kirby starts by delving into the origins of the popular song “The 12 Days of Christmas.” He explains that the song originated from the influence of Western culture on the Christian faith. Each part of the song references an aspect of the Christian tradition, such as the two commandments, the three gifts of faith, hope, and love, and the four gospel books.
The discussion highlights the symbolic meaning behind each gift mentioned in the song. For example, the first gift, the Turtle Dove, represents Jesus Christ. The 11 pipers piping symbolize the faithful apostles celebrating the resurrection of Jesus. The 12th part of the song refers to the 12 points of the Apostles’ Creed, directing the singer back to the teachings of the faith.
Father Kirby proposes the idea of bringing elements of faith back into our celebrations, especially during the 12-day Christmas season. He suggests using traditional songs like the 12 Days of Christmas to remind Christians of the true meaning of Christmas and to teach and memorize elements of the faith. He believes that popular culture can be used as a tool for evangelization and emphasizes the difference between secular Christmas celebrations and the Christian Christmas celebrated by believers.
Overall, this episode of Roadmap to Heaven provides information on the significance of the 12 Days of Christmas song and encourages listeners to embrace the fullness of the Christmas season, beyond just a single day, in a way that deepens their faith.
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